Viewing topic: New, Tougher Rules for Business Visas

I was reading this on the moscow times website today, that they will only be letting foreigners in for 90 out of every 180 days. Exceptions for those work permits and/or residence permits.
Does anyone know if this will affect UK citizens?
I would have thought since Russians can visit the UK 6 months at a time that we could continue to do the same in Russia.

heres the link http://www.themoscowtimes.com/stories/2007/10/22/004.html

The phone has been buzzing all day here at VisaRus inc

If this is actually implemented, we're all fucked

Unless we get proper contracts with work visas and work permits (not worth the hassle for the sake of living in a hostile state) or student visas, we've basically got our marching orders.

There *might* be some kind of dispensation introduced for English teachers - although we're here pretty much illegally, we're also to some extent 'necessary' to the country.

However, so far we haven't found any reference to this new law on the Russian gov't website, but watch this space.

In the meantime, I will be looking into 'escape plans' for teachers in Russia Expect VisaRus to be re-entitled 'How to get out of teaching in Russia'.

In a sense, as a translator my business is fairly safe - I could get by staying in Finland or Estonia and only coming to Russia once or twice month to meet with my clients. It will, of course, pose a major obstacle that would force me to diversify. Maybe not a bad thing.

It's probably going to screw up sales of my e-book though

For now, all we can do is sit tight and wait to see what happens. This, however, is something that I've been waiting for, albeit not prepared for. We've had it ridiculously easy for years, and for all the time I've been here I've had an inkling that we were in for getting the rug pulled out from under us.

Very few of the expats I know use anything other than business visas.

This is just another example of the schizophrenic nature of the Russian administration. One minute they're simplifying the visa procedure for Europeans, the next they're complicating it again. It will never stop.

On the other hand, there may be some benefit to be had from, it - those who either defy the new law or find ways round it will be like kids in candy shops and will be able to name their prices to language schools.

Alternatively it may be a boost to the language schools that offer trips out of the country with language camps. They may just see a rise in demand triggered by the lack of native teachers in the country until something changes again, or until teachers file back in with residency permits.

It might lead to the 'death' of some of the smaller schools, and the rise of those that legalise their teachers.

Time will tell. Watch this space!

Well this has certainly hampered my plans. I visited redtape.ru and read in the forum that someone went on a visa run to Kiev and had his visa stamped with this new 90-180 rules bullcrap. So, I guess it has already been implemented. What are we to do? Why Russia...why? Maybe I need to go back to my plan of teaching in Ukraine.

As I'm slightly drunk at the moment (it is Monday evening, after all ), all I'll say for now is - DONT'T PANIC!

In the past we've had lots of various scares. There are always ways around them. I will be looking into them as will every teacher, school and visa agency in Russia. There will be a solution - it's Russia after all

Oh I hope you are right Bobs. Perhaps my lack of experience in Russia has made me more worrisome than seasoned vets like yourself. I hope your optimism doesn't simply stem from your apparent drunkenness

notthhionngg to wwworrry abboutttt

Well it's definitely being enforced as we speak, I read that it does include ALL countries.

Meanwhile I have looked at work visas/ permits and TRP's ...you don't want to take that road, reading about it was tiresome enough!

Yep. The Residence Permit route is not worth the hassle.

Fear not, it should be sorted out.

I think it's been brought in because the 'crackdown' on illegal workers last year didn't yield the results expected.

Not to cause a panic, but I'm looking at Finland and Estonia as places to hole out until the mess sorts itself out. I'm sure it will clear up before I have to go anywhere, but I personally can't be arsed with any more bureaucracy than I currently have to deal with! In any case, it always pays to be prepared.

I found the Moscow Times link to be passworded so, for anyone who has had the same problem, here is a similar story from the SPB Times: Thanks for bringing this to everyone's attention. At least all of us who may be affected hopefully have a bit of time to reflect on what to do..
***************************************
MOSCOW — The government is tightening the screws on foreigners who want to work here full time without a work visa — and itinerant English teachers look likely to be the first to feel the squeeze.

Multiple-entry business visas, which used to let foreigners stay in Russia for up to one year, will now only allow stays of up to 90 days at a time, according to a decree signed by Prime Minister Viktor Zubkov on Oct. 4.

Under the new rules, such visas will still last one year. But they will only let people stay in Russia for up to 180 days of that year, and for no longer than 90 days at a time. Moreover, if a foreigner stays in Russia for 90 days straight, he or she is then required to leave and not come back until another 90 days have passed.

Zubkov’s decree also says foreigners might have to obtain the visas in their native countries — which implies that U.S. and British expatriates could no longer take the bus to Helsinki for a visa run. But representatives of visa agencies and foreign business lobbies were unsure how that rule would be implemented, and some said it might not apply to Westerners.

What is clear, however, is that expats can no longer stay in Russia endlessly by obtaining multiple-entry business visas and renewing them each year, said Alexei Filippenkov, director of the Visa Delight agency.

“Now, any foreigner who wants to come live here has to either go through the immigration process, and eventually obtain a residence permit, or else find an employer who will prepare a work visa for them,” Filippenkov said.

Foreigners with work visas are not affected by the change.

It is unclear whether the new rules will affect foreigners with multiple-entry business visas issued before Zubkov’s decree. But Filippenkov said it was unlikely.

Spokespeople for the Foreign Ministry and the Federal Migration Service declined to comment by telephone Friday, saying that all questions had to be submitted in writing. E-mails sent to the agencies were not answered as of Sunday.

The new rules could complicate life for expat English teachers, many of whom have multiple-entry business visas.

“If people have to come for 90 days and then leave, this will be very disruptive for the teaching process,” said Helen Panovich, academic director of ITC, a company that hires English-language native speakers to give lessons to Russian businessmen.

Amy Cartwright, a spokeswoman for the Association of European Businesses, said most of AEB’s member companies would not be affected because their foreign employees had work visas.

But she singled out expat English teachers as a potential trouble spot. “It’s very worrying because it means that if you’re a teacher, for example, and if you’re on a business visa, you can’t stay here,” Cartwright said.

AEB has met with representatives of the Federal Migration Service to find out how the rules will be implemented, and one of the open questions is whether expats will have to return to their home country to obtain a business visa, she said.

“We don’t have an answer yet, but we have asked them,” Cartwright said.

Representatives of visa agencies had different takes on the provision in Zubkov’s decree about returning to one’s home country for a visa.

Timur Beslangurov, managing director of Vista Foreign Business Support, said foreigners would be able to obtain visas in the Russian embassy of any country as long as they could present a residence permit for that country, or at least some document proving that they had the right to live there for 90 days.

Filippenkov, of Visa Delight, said the provision about returning to one’s home country did not apply to Westerners and was instead directed at countries like China, Turkey and India.

Russian embassies are notoriously inconsistent in their approach to issuing visas. In the past, it has often taken several months to see how rule changes are implemented.

Zubkov’s decree puts Russia on the same footing as many Western countries, which also draw a distinction between visas designed for short visits and visas that grant one the right to work.

U.S. citizens who visit Britain, for example, are allowed to stay for up to six months, but they get a stamp in their passport stating they are prohibited from working there.

“The government is making things work the same way as they do in America and Europe,” Filippenkov said. Russian citizens face the exact same 90- and 180-day restrictions in Germany, he added.

Still, such comparisons have not reassured expats accustomed to the ease of obtaining multiple-entry business visas and daunted by the obstacles of getting Russian work permits.

“What will they think of next?” asked one visitor at RedTape.ru. “Shooting all foreigners? Might be quicker to get rid of us that way!”

A foreign national doesn't need a work permit if he/she:

* permanently resides in the Russian Federation
* temporarily resides in the Russian Federation
* is an employee of the diplomatic corps or of the consular institutions of foreign states in the Russian Federation
* is an employee hired to assemble and maintain equipment imported into Russia by a foreign company
* is a journalist accredited in the Russian Federation
* is a student studying in Russia and working during his spare time
* is a lecturer or teacher invited by an educational organization

In the circumstances other than those mentioned above, Russian Government adopts an annual employment quota limiting number of foreign nationals coming to the Russian Federation in order to work.

link - http://www.eng.cliff.ru/inrussia/

The last rule there about teachers, is it going to change? It says they don't need a work permit if they have the invitation from the edu ogzn, then what type of visa would it be? and would it be exempt from the new 90 day law?

Hi Martin,

I think that it would need to be educational institution authorised to do invitations such as a university or polytechnic or any language school prepared to negotiate the perhaps new, no-doubt myriad of paperwork needed to get approval. Who knows what type of visa it might be. Maybe they might even create a new category especially for this....?

However, I thinks Bobs12 is not mistaken (I'm fed up with saying "I agree". This is Russia and undue panic is not warranted (yet), although possible options should, of course, be investigated now. According to the Комитет миграционного контроля Санкт-Петербург (SPB Migration Control Office) this morning, they know absolutely nothing at all about the new stuff and suggested calling back in about a week or so....when, of course, they may still know nothing...

So stay cool seems to be the preferred option for the time being.

McGavock wrote:

A foreign national doesn't need a work permit if he/she:

* is an employee hired to assemble and maintain equipment imported into Russia by a foreign company

Ditto.

Steve got that post in while I was typing.

Exactly like Steve said - in Russia the right hand doesn't usually have the foggiest what the left is doing. It takes silly amounts of time for legislatory changes to percolate through the system.

The fun thing is that it's a bit like a game of Chinese Whispers when they do. By the time the rules get relayed to OVIR and the border guards (pretty much the second and first lines of implementation, respectively) you have Germans dancing on a wet plank and an urgent need for three and fourpence. I don't include the street militsia in this because their interpretation will always be the same, no matter what the law.

Even at that, the different executive bodies will still have their own interpretations of the ambiguities in the law. 90 in, 90 out may seem fairly unambiguous, but where there are dispensations there is ambiguity as to who fits into what categories. Thus there is always a way out.

Nonetheless, this is just another in a series of turns on the immigration screw, and Steve is right - even if this blows over - we do all seriously need to be putting serious thought into contingency plans. Russia has only been Russia for a few years - it's still making its mind up on a lot of things and casting its future identity, hence the apparent teenage complexes, minor schizophrenia, bipolar disorder and other malaises.

Addendum:

Russian lawmakers don't generally specify how a law is to be implemented. This is important to bear in mind when reading the above and thinking "WTF is he on about?"

The slightly decentralised power structure of the RF system means that it's up to bodies further down the line to decide how to handle the decrees from the top.

In some respects, it's no surprise that дядя Вова wants to rein decision-making powers back in to the state Duma.

I must have come across the same post as Christian (Gurdow) , seems like the kiev-run guy is one of the first people to get a business visa in the past few days to have reported the new 90-180 as being printed on the visa.

Well I think I might hold back on applying for the business visa (I was going pay for the invite today)

I'll believe it once I hear a few more reports like this, and confirmation of this 90 limit being stamped upon registration of the 'new visa'

Yep.

Bear in mind different consulates also apply rules differently with visa apps.

Some require the HIV test, some don't, some want a cover letter, some don't, etc. etc. etc.

I wouldn't be too surprised if this might be a similar situation.

I read the post on expat.ru that I guess you're referring to - I got my last visa in July with no mention of any 90 day rules. Alex_j got his visa in late September - also no 90-day crap.

It seems there is some confusion about the exact timing of when these rules actually came into force - some seem to say from June, some say only from October.

I'll be making some enquiries with the agency that does my visa this week, and with some schools in the city. But not until after tomorrow because I have to finish a monster translation about condoms, lubricants and vibrators. Oh I love being a translator sometimes

I've just received a message saying that two Australians have been refused a visa in Tallinn - under the new law, they have to apply in Australia.

This *shouldn't* affect EU citizens' ability to get visas anywhere in the EU - if I understood correctly, the law states that you can apply anywhere that you have the 'right of abode'. I think this means an EU citizen can apply anywhere in the EU.

The screw turns...

That came from waytorussia.net - http://www.waytorussia.net/TalkLounge/quote-75018.html#75018

If the new laws are based on reciprocity, then Brits just might not be affected by the 90/180 rules as I believe ordinary UK visas for Russians do not have a time limit? Someone correct me on this?

If the new laws are based on reciprocity, then Brits just might not be affected by the 90/180 rules as I believe ordinary UK visas for Russians do not have a time limit? Someone correct me on this?[/quote]


I can confirm that Bobs, My ex-girlfriend had this visa which allowed her to stay for 6 full months.

I was thinking along the same lines about reciprocity, and was hoping there would be that reciprocal agreement on the visas. Time will tell...

I'll call the Edinburgh embassy tomorrow and see what they have to say.

I've just been speaking to Mike Sherman at ALM.

The situation for roaming English teachers won't be much simpler - they won't really be able just to go to a friendly school and get a visa invitation.

If, as I understand, the application and 90/180 rules don't apply to work visas (note this is entirely different from a work permit, although if you're a teacher invited by a school through the proper channles, you shouldn't need a permit) then schools that can issue invitations for their own teachers shouldn't be too hard hit.

However, they won't be keen to do this, as they then carry a lot of responsibility for the actions of invitees. Additionally, they may come under the Foreign Employee Quota rule and will only have a limited number of invitations to give out. Getting a work invite from a school that you won't actually be working for looks like it will be unlikely to happen, or very expensive if it does.

It seems all the same restrictions will apply to ME business visas, regardless of who the invitation comes from.

It does look like private and freelance teachers could be in for a big headache.

I keep taking too long to type posts

When did your g/f have the visa? Mine lets me stay for 6 months, but the visas in question, it seems, are the ones being issued pretty much *now*, i.e. this month.

It was January 17th in Moscow this year she had it issued and as far as I am aware nothing has changed with regards to Russians getting UK visas (but don't quote me on that)

Nah, that was before any of the new regulations came into force.

I got mine in July (according to some sources, the rules were in effect then) and haven't left the country since, but there was no mention of any changes.

Please do call the Consulate tomorrow and let us know what they say!

woh woh wohhhh Hold up

my ex gf was a Russian with the UK visa , just to make that clear, you were looking for confirmation on the 6 months visas w/o a break that Russians obtain.

well we'll see what goss the emassy's got..

Duh!

This Durex translation is addling my brains.

That's good to know. Will be waiting impatiently for your update!

"Russian citizens applying for tourist visas, in nearly all cases, receive visas valid for one year. However, they may ask for a visa valid for two years. If the visa is approved, the applicant must pay an additional $100 at that time in order to receive the visa valid for two years." - U.S. Embassy website (The part about the $100 fee is a bit redundant, unless a Russian is reading this post). I didn't read anything about a 90/180 rule for Russian nationals obtaining an American visa. No mention of a 3-month-at-a-time nonsense either. So, if these laws are based on reciprocity, then I might not be affected either. But I guess I wouldn't be able to make a visa run to, say, Talinn because I am not an EU citizen.

The first time I heard about all this 90-180 day crap, porabably early in the year or last year...can't remember.

I thought it was only for countries that signed an agreement? correct me if i'm wrong. I don't know if it was implemented when it happened.

Now at that time were the citizens of these EU countries in uproar like we are now?
Did this rule apply to these countries that singed the agreement first?

It seems like it's just become a set law for everyone whether our Native countries sigend an agreement or not.

I have been speaking to Chris at Realrussia the company I always use for visas.

They make they're applications through the London embassy.

He asked an official at the embassy how and when they will be implementing the new rules.

To which they replied - what new rules? we know nothing about this!

That makes sense.

I think if I understood correctly, me and Alex_j both got our visas after the actual 90/180 thing was introduced, but it may be that the consulates we went to just weren't in the know. Not as unusual as you'd imagine! Although how this can happen really beats me

Now, I've been in touch with a long-term veteran here, whose visa agency is apparently in the know. They're telling him to get residency. He's of UK origin. Dammit.

The visa agency may be wrong though - if an embassy doesn't know the rules, who does?!

In the meantime, I'm looking for a job teaching Russian in Finland or Sweden

mememe wrote:

Russian embassies are notoriously inconsistent in their approach to issuing visas. In the past, it has often taken several months to see how rule changes are implemented.

Yes, you ARE rambling, BOBS12, so much so that you are attributing things to people who never wrote them...

I DIDN'T actually write that (but probably would have, if I had thought of it....) Or am I just getting senile...?

We are just a-rambling all together......

I received my new visa in September and it says nothing about any 30/ 90 split. In fact they actually gave me a few extra days (367) of validity. This from the Seattle, Washington consulate.

My visa contact ( Salni tourist services) knows nothing about any changes or restrictions for existing visa holders. So it appears that anyone holding a currently valid visa is grandfathered in.

As for residency... yeah, good luck with that. I've been after my residency card for over 5 years now and am no closer to getting it than I was on day one. Hell, I can't even get registered at my own apartment.

Work visas are just bad all the way around because then you are beholden to the visa issuer and anyone who thinks that at least some schools won't hold it over your head like an axe is sadly mistaken.

Hi Phil

Hi Steve

To correct my rambling bobshit:

mememe, quoting the spazzy SP Times wrote:

Russian embassies are notoriously inconsistent in their approach to issuing visas. In the past, it has often taken several months to see how rule changes are implemented.

F*** it , im going for it. I'm going to order a visa today.

we'll see what happens when I get in about a months time.

That's the spirit!

Never known a Scotsman to be defeated by mere bureaucracy

Tchez tells me he got his visa in the last two weeks with no mention of the new rules, but was warned by his visa agency that when his 3 month registration ends, he may not be able to get it renewed.

If this is so, others may be affected in the same way, even if their visas were issued earlier.

You mean people actually register? I've just found it easier (and cheaper) to give the border guard $50... Of course this follows a bit of heated negotiation, but it's always worked for me...

Yep, but I wouldn't recommend that to anyone I need my registration - although I don't travel so much at the moment, at times I need to cross the border fairly regularly. 50 bucks a pop would be a bit of a pain I generally try to abide by the rules that don't take too much effort - I like to think it makes up for the ones I break There are other things you need registration for, too.

Horrendously bad PROMT translation of the changes (http://www.rg.ru/2007/10/10/visa-dok.html) made to the visa rules (http://www.rg.ru/oficial/doc/postan_rf/335-03.shtm) is below for your enjoyment.

I might translate it all myself properly later on, but I'm too tired right now. And the nonsense below won't be much more understandable even if it's translated properly


1. In the subitem "in" item 7 of a word " " to replace the Ministry of Internal Affairs of the Russian Federation and its territorial body words " the Federal migratory service and its territorial body ".

2. The paragraph of the second of item 8 to state in following edition:

" The authorized state body, having the right to renew the visa and to cancel the visa, the boundary body of Federal security service of the Russian Federation, located in a check point through frontier of the Russian Federation is. ".

3. To add with item 91 of the following maintenance:

" 91. To the foreign citizen who is being the state, not being the state of its civil accessory, the visa is made out and stands out only under condition of presence at it the sanction to continuous stay in this country more than 90 days.

The visa can be issued and given out to the foreign citizen who is being the state, not being by the state of its civil accessory, without observance of the specified condition:

Under the decision of the head of diplomatic representatives or consular establishment of the Russian Federation in connection with necessity of entrance to the Russian Federation for participation in the international and interstate official, economic, political, scientific, cultural, sports and religious actions, or for emergency treatment, or owing to heavy illness or death of the close relative living in the Russian Federation;

Under the decision of the Ministry for Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation on the basis of the international principle of reciprocity. ".

4. In item 16 of a word " the Ministries of Internal Affairs of the Russian Federation " to replace with words of " Federal migratory service ".

5. Item 17 to add with the paragraph of the following maintenance:

" Total term of stay of the foreign citizen in the Russian Federation under the multi-visa is established at registration of the visa by the authorized state body, but no more than 90 days during each period in 180 days, except for the cases stipulated by the present Position. ".

6. Item 29 to state in following edition:

" 29. The ordinary business visa stands out to the foreign citizen driving to the Russian Federation with the business purposes. The ordinary business visa can be unitary or double for the term of till 3 months or repeated for the term of till 1 year. Total term of stay of the foreign citizen in territory of the Russian Federation under the repeated business visa is established according to the paragraph of third item 17 of the present Position.

The ordinary business visa is made out on the basis of the invitation to entrance to the Russian Federation, issued according to the legislation of the Russian Federation (further is called - the invitation), decisions of the Ministry for Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation on delivery to the foreign citizen of the visa, directed in diplomatic representatives or consular establishment of the Russian Federation, or the decision of the head of diplomatic representatives or consular establishment of the Russian Federation in connection with necessity of entrance to the Russian Federation for participation in the international and interstate official, economic, political and scientific actions under the written application of the foreign citizen. ".

7. In item 33:

In the paragraph the first words " (the tourist voucher) " to exclude;

The paragraph of the second to recognize become invalid.

8. In items 34 and 35 words " territorial body of the Ministry of Internal Affairs of the Russian Federation in a place of registration " to replace with words " territorial body of Federal migratory service in a place of statement with the migratory account in a place of stay ".

9. Item 36 to state in following edition:

" 36. The ordinary humanitarian visa stands out to the foreign citizen driving to the Russian Federation with a view of realization of scientific, cultural, political, sports or religious communications and contacts, pilgrimage, charities or delivery of the humanitarian help. The ordinary humanitarian visa can be unitary or double for the term of till 3 months or repeated for the term of till 1 year. Total term of stay of the foreign citizen in territory of the Russian Federation under the repeated humanitarian visa is established according to the paragraph of third item 17 of the present Position.

The ordinary humanitarian visa is made out on the basis of the invitation or the decision of the head of diplomatic representatives or consular establishment of the Russian Federation in connection with necessity of entrance to the Russian Federation for participation in the international and interstate official, political, scientific, cultural, sports and religious actions under the written application of the foreign citizen for the term of till 3 months (unitary or double) or for the term of till 1 year (repeated), and also on the basis of the decision of the Ministry for Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation on delivery to the foreign citizen of the visa, directed in diplomatic representatives or consular establishment of the Russian Federation, for the term of till 90 days (unitary or double). ".

10. In item 37 of a word " the Ministries of Internal Affairs of the Russian Federation " to replace with words of " Federal migratory service ".

11. In items 38 and 39 words of "day" to replace with words of "days".

12. In item 43 of a word " the Ministries of Internal Affairs of the Russian Federation " to replace with words of " Federal migratory service ".

13. Item 56 to state in following edition:

" 56. Machine-readable visa forms of the first series (from 10 up to 19) are used by Federal migratory service and its territorial bodies. The charges connected with manufacturing of specified visa forms, are carried out by Federal migratory service due to the means stipulated in the federal budget on the current maintenance of Service. ".

14. In the paragraph the second item 61 of a word " the Ministry of Internal Affairs of the Russian Federation " to replace with words " Federal migratory service ".

15. Item 67 to state in following edition:

" 67. Validity of the visa during stay of the foreign citizen in the Russian Federation can be prolonged:

The Ministry for Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation or representation of the Ministry for Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation in territory of the Russian Federation in coordination with Federal security service of the Russian Federation - for the term of, necessary for performance by the foreign citizen of the functions assigned to it directed state or the international organization (on the basis of the reference of diplomatic representatives or consular establishment of the foreign state or the international organization or its representation);

Representation of the Ministry for Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation, being within the limits of frontier territory (including in a check point through frontier of the Russian Federation), or boundary body of Federal security service of the Russian Federation - no more than for 3 days (in case of need departure of the foreign citizen territory of the Russian Federation);

Federal migratory service and its territorial bodies:

In case of occurrence of necessity - no more than for 10 days (at presence of the documents confirming necessity of such prolongation and provided that total term of stay of the foreign citizen in the Russian Federation does not exceed the term established according to the paragraph of third item 17 of the present Position);

In case of absence of an opportunity for the foreign citizen to leave territory of the Russian Federation in connection with necessity of its emergency treatment, heavy illness or death of the close relative living in the Russian Federation, - for the term of, necessary for acceptance of the measures caused by developed circumstances and departure of the foreign citizen the Russian Federation (by granting the document confirming presence of given circumstances);

In case of absence of an opportunity for the foreign citizen to leave territory of the Russian Federation in connection with occurrence of force majeure circumstances (extreme and impreventable circumstances under the given conditions), and also the phenomena of spontaneous character.

Prolongation of validity of the visa is carried out by the specified state bodies in a place of statement of the foreign citizen on the migratory account in a place of stay, or in a place of its actual stay, or in a check point through frontier of the Russian Federation. ".

16. In item 69:

Words " the authorized state body " to replace with words " Federal migratory service and its territorial bodies ";

To add with the paragraph of the following maintenance:

" The representation of the Ministry for Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation, being within the limits of frontier territory (including in a check point through frontier of the Russian Federation), or boundary body of Federal security service of the Russian Federation prolongs visas on the basis of the written application of the foreign citizen. ".

17. To add with item 711 of the following maintenance:

" 711. Prolongation of validity of the visa issued on the machine-readable visa form, is carried out by boundary body of Federal security service of the Russian Federation in a check point through frontier of the Russian Federation by putting down in the passport мастичного a stamp filled under the form and by way of which are defined by Federal security service of the Russian Federation. ".

18. In the paragraph the first item 73 of a word " together with the Ministry of Internal Affairs of the Russian Federation " to replace with words " and Federal migratory service ".

19. In item 75 of a word " the Ministries of Internal Affairs of the Russian Federation or division of the federal enforcement authority knowing questions of boundary service, " to replace with words " Federal migratory service or boundary body of Federal security service of the Russian Federation ".

20. In item 76 of a word " division of the federal enforcement authority knowing questions of boundary service, " to replace with words " boundary body of Federal security service of the Russian Federation ".

21. Item 83 after a word "prolong" to add with words " according to the paragraph of third item 67 of the present Position ".

22. In item 85 of a word " the Ministry of Internal Affairs of the Russian Federation and it " to replace with words " the Federal migratory service and it ".

23. Item 86 to state in following edition:

" 86. Boundary bodies of Federal security service of the Russian Federation in check points through frontier of the Russian Federation cancel visas, and at absence in a check point of representation of the Ministry for Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation - prolong the visa of the foreign citizen according to the paragraph of third item 67 of the present Position. ".

24. To add with item 87 of the following maintenance:

" 87. The order of the organization of activity of the Ministry for Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation, Federal migratory service and Federal security service of the Russian Federation on registration, delivery, prolongation of validity of the visa, restoration or cancellation of the visa, and also the order of the account and storage of forms of visas are defined by the specified federal enforcement authorities. ".

25. In item 2 of appendix N 1 to the specified Position:

Subitem 1 to state in following edition:

" 1) unitary " 1 ", double " 2 " or repeated " m " the visa; ";

In subitem 14 of a word " number of the voucher " to replace with words " number of acknowledgement on reception of the foreign tourist ".

26. In appendix N 2 to the specified Position:

In item 2 of a word " number of the voucher " to replace with words " number of acknowledgement on reception of the foreign tourist ";

In item 9 of a word of "internal affairs" to replace with words of " Federal migratory service ".

My 2 cents

Are they stamping 90/180 on the entry stamp or is it printed somewhere on the actual visa?

If it's on the entry stamp (doubtful), then it'll be a real problem. The border guards can check it everytime someone enters.

However, if it's on the actual visa, it's easy enough to figure out what consulates will give the buisness visa w/o the 90/180 stamp. My guess is that Finland, Western Europe, and the US will give the visa w/o the stamp and other consulates (Ukraine) will give the visa w/ the stamp. The reason being is that they want to control immigration from poorer countries. There's not too many Europeans/Americans (with the exception of K), living hand to mouth, in run down tenements, and working working low paying jobs in the market.

Worst case (if it's on the visa -- not the entry stamp) is that you have to leave every 3 months and re-register, instead of every 6 months. They're going to be too disorganized at the border to call the OVIR and check if the paperwork is in order so that the person can stay the entire 180 days. Likewise, the OVIR is going to be to disorganized to check when the person re-registers.

K is indeed a real star

It's a bit more serious than that. Looks like if you're US national, you have to get your visa in the US, Chinese - in China etc. etc.

Also seems to be irrelevant as to what is written on the visa - they can write pretty much anything on it, or write nothing. The presence or absence of 90/180 on the visa itself needn't mean that everything is okay.

One other point:

None of the foreigners living in an apartment are registered properly. Everybody gets registered through a hotel. If the OVIR relly cared to, they could check the records and find out the person isn't properly registered. I suspect the 90/180 rule might be something like this once it gets sorted out.

The problem if 90/180 is on the actual visa or stamped somewhere is that the border guards can check the entry/exit stamp. If it's not on there you tell them it's a work visa or whatever.

Whatever, somebody will figure something out in a few months. In addition to english teachers, there are a bunch of other ex-pats in Russia doing other poductive things for the economy.

Also, what about applying for a new visa every 3 months?

It doesn't have to be stamped anywhere Tim, it just applies to all visas after the date the changes in the law were made. I think they don't have to write anything in your passport or on your visa.

Ah ha. I see the problem . How are they going to enforce it? Any ideas? Prevent registration for more than 90 days or check the entry date when people try and leave?

Also, if it doesn't matter, why are they issuing visas with the 90/180 stamp (the one that the guy in Ukraine was talking about), and others without the 90/180 stamp (some guy mentioned getting his a month ago in Seattle)?

One other thing from the news article listed above (the one that's causing the stir):

"....
Foreigners with work visas are not affected by the change.

It is unclear whether the new rules will affect foreigners with multiple-entry business visas issued before Zubkov’s decree. But Filippenkov said it was unlikely.

..."

If that's true, it won't affect anyone that already has the old visa (such as myself).

In the final analysis, if I wanted a boaring life, I'd still be in NYC working as a patent attorney. At the very least, the new regulations will make life interesting.

The rule was apparently brought in less than a month ago. In theory it shouldn't affect visas issued before the law was passed, but this is Russia. All laws are enforced according to the executive bodies' *interpretation* of them.

Their *interpretation* can be affected by time of day, level of nicotine/alcohol/caffeine/other substances in the bloodstream, time of month, time since last shag, weather, amount of money you leave where they can see it, etc. etc.

Enforcement of visa rules is pretty simple.

We all know the penalty for bugering about with registration etc. is generally a bribe, but that overstaying the end of your visa can be a big bribe, or worse.

If they are bringing things in line with the EU, there is a simple thing they can do to you if you try to leave after having overstayed - annul your visa and not let you back in. I think 5 years is the default period for blacklisting?

While the 90 day thing could obviously be abused - unless you are stopped by officious menty - any abuse will have some kind of consequence.

As for whether this will apply to our visas - yes, they shouldn't shift the goalposts once we have our visas. They *shouldn't* be able to change the conditions of the visa itself.

They shouldn't be able to change the rules about registration and then make them apply so that existing registrations suddenly become null and void.

But they could apply different rules the next time you go for registration. E.g. 'no, you can't have registration because you've already been here 90 days or more. You'll have to leave.

Visas are your right to enter the country, registration is your right to remain. The visa rule change might not get me because they can't change the conditions once it's been issued, but registration is a regular event, and nothing about the old type of visa says you can't be refused registration.

True, life is less boring here. But the excitement of feeling persecuted loses its lustre. I think very few of us would be so happy in the whole deal if we didn't know that we could easily leave tomorrow for a friendlier state. Sadly, the longer you stay, the more of a wrench that will become.

I am also hoping to hell that I won't come under the 90/180 rule on my current visa. However, I'm already waiting for the next turn of the screw. Personally, I hate b